How Each Generation Wants to Engage With Local Government

Tyler Podcast Episode 19, Transcript

Our Tyler Technologies podcast explores a wide range of complex, timely, and important issues facing communities and the public sector. Expect approachable tech talk mixed with insights from subject matter experts and a bit of fun. Host and content marketing director Jeff Harrell – and other guest hosts – highlights the people, places, and technology making a difference. Give us listen today and subscribe.

Episode Summary

We kick off Season Two of the Tyler Tech Podcast with a "best of" compilation of the breakthrough research separating myth from truth in how each generation wants to engage with their local government. Generational expert Jason Dorsey walks us through each generation, hand-picking the biggest discoveries from the research, giving local government leaders incredible insight as they work to engage with their community.

Transcript

Jason Dorsey: If you want to effectively engage each generation, you do have to recognize them and choose to adapt. Technology seems to be that through line of what they all want to drive more engagement and they want to be able to do it on a way that's comfortable, easy and effective for them on their own terms.

Jeff Harrell: From Tyler Technologies, it's the Tyler Tech Podcast, where we talk about issues facing communities today and highlight the people, places, and technology, making a difference. I'm your host, Jeff Harrell. I'm the director of content marketing for Tyler, and I'm so glad that you've joined me. Well, happy new year and welcome to season two. This is our first episode of 2021. And we've got a lot of big plans in store for the podcast to bring you some really great stories and really great information. We're kicking off this new season with a mashup of the custom research we did with the Center for Generational Kinetics, where we separated the myth from truth, by looking at how the four major generations that make up communities today want to engage with and interact with local government. I think you'll really enjoy this fresh compilation and we'll kick it off by looking first into the youngest generation actively interacting with government and that's Generation Z. Let's get started by getting to know more about these Center for Generational Kinetics and its president Jason Dorsey.

Jeff Harrell: Well, Jason man, we are excited to have you here today and we are excited to partner with you and the Center for Generational Kinetics. Could you tell us a little bit more about you and CGK?

Jason Dorsey: Yeah. Sure. Thanks so much, really glad to be here with you and talking about such an important topic. At the Center for Generational Kinetics, we are all about separating generational myth from truth. So much of what is said about generations is just simply not accurate, but it's great click bait headlines on social media or people talk about it publicly, but it's not grounded in data. And at CGK, we are all about research to separate myth from truth through data, specifically looking at the behavioral drivers by generations. For example, in our relationship, we're trying to figure out what really drives what's true about how different generations engage with government? At CGK what makes us different, we've led research and worked with more than 700 clients around the world. I've been on more than 200 television shows, written some bestselling books, and most importantly, I just love digging into the data and figuring out what's really going on so leaders can make more informed, more accurate decisions and just fired up to be here with you today. This is going to be a great conversation.

Gen Z

Jeff Harrell: So how would you define Gen Z? What's what's the definition of Gen Z?

Jason Dorsey: We define this generation as being born approximately, 1996 to about 2012. The reason we look at that is that Gen Z, their parents are Generation X. And this is so important because in our research, what we've seen is, parenting is the biggest driver of behaviors, whether that's how you view work, whether that's how you view spending, even engaging with government. So important is driven by parents and the parents of Gen Z are Gen X and even older millennials. So we see a very consistent and interesting parenting trend there. At the same time, Gen Z has always known smart technology. They don't remember a time before the Cloud. We were interviewing students for the new book through our middle school and high school, and they're turning in everything through a variety of tech platforms, will never turn in a printed piece of paper. And this is so important because people often say, "Oh, Gen Z represents change." And we're like, "No, no, that's not true." All Gen Z is doing is bringing what they believe is normal to every environment. To them it's not even change. It's just what is normal. So this huge generations, Gen Z, what we see is that they're already up to about age 23, 24 ish, very different view of technology, very different way they've been raised, different view of employers, and now they're coming of age right around this pandemic, and it's going to have profound implications for them. And that's why this research is so incredibly important.

Jeff Harrell: You've done a lot of research, you've talked to a lot of Gen Zers, what was the biggest surprise to you when we did this research?

Jason Dorsey: We've led more than 65 generational studies around the world and a number of industries. This was a very statistically rigorous study. We are a research firm led by PhDs. We don't mess around when it comes to research. So our margin of error is plus, or minus 3.1 19 out of 20 times, which all that means is this is the gold standard for people that do research or that are statistically valid. And this is a true, accurate snapshot of each generation as it relates to government and their experiences throughout the United States. And I say that because what I'm about to share with you may seem super shocking, and that is Gen Z was shockingly similar to baby boomers. It's so fascinating, because I guarantee you, if we had pulled a room, nobody would've guessed that those two generations were most similar, but we just saw it so consistently in the data that Gen Z and baby boomers had very, very similar interactions, expectations and so forth, when it came to their thoughts about engaging with government. And I think that's so important for leaders to know now.

Jeff Harrell: And why do you think that is? Because I saw that as well and thought they would've aligned much more with millennials. Why do they align more with boomers that bookend generation?

Jason Dorsey: I think it has to do with two things. One is life stage where Gen Z is currently. They certainly seem to think differently about things like stability, trust, loyalty, engagement and other areas like that. And I think that's really powerful because the baby boomers in our other research have exhibited the same characteristics. In fact, we frequently refer to Gen Z as a throwback generation, but we've never had such clear and consistent data as we have now in this study with Tyler. And I think that's so powerful because for the first time, it's going to give a roadmap to government leaders to understand, "Hey, we can't be one size fits all, but we do need to think about engagement in ways that work across generations. And so I think what you're seeing here is a reflection of parenting. Like we talked about, it's a reflection of their views around the world and how they interact with it. And I think that this is something that they may not grow out of. This is such a profound connection to how they think about government engagement, leadership, loyalty, and so forth. That they're likely to carry this with them and not shed it as they get older. And it also means to me that government leaders are now going to have to step back and say, "Okay, we've tried a lot of different things, but many times government really is built for the people that are in power or have been, but Gen Z's coming in and they're going to bring change relative to millennials. And so we got to be really thoughtful. The other thing that I think is really important is that every single generation wanted to engage more deeply with government.

Jason Dorsey: And I think that's important because I think there's this myth out there in the world that certain generations don't care about government or government leaders. And they're all one big shrug or myth. But the reality is every single generation felt that there was an opportunity to drive deeper engagement with government. That's so important. And I would argue maybe even it's never been more important than it is right now.

Jeff Harrell: One staff that caught my attention is that 62% of Gen Z, remember these are people up to 24 years old, 62% say they have had a positive experience with local government. That's the highest of any generation yet. They've had fewer interactions with local government than any other generation. Was that surprising to you like it was for me?

Jason Dorsey: It was a surprise from a generational standpoint, but not as much of a surprise from a life stage. And this is where we get into this interesting conversation about generation crashing into life stage. And as I always like to remind people, you stay in the same generation, you just get older. So when it comes to interacting with local government, and if we think about this broadly speaking, maybe we've got 18 to 24, you could argue 16 to 24, if we take into account driver's licenses. So a lot of the interactions that Gen Z has had, have been things around licenses, maybe speeding tickets could be things tied to voting. So the threshold of the types of experiences they have had have been somewhat limited, but based on those limited experiences, they would say they've had a pretty good one. And I think that also is reflective of many governments saying, "Hey, we're going to make things easier to do online."

Jason Dorsey: And so Gen Z has really benefited from that and saying, "Hey, this is how we want to engage." We saw that a ton in the data here, the types of experiences and how satisfied other generations are, is very different than Gen Z. And I think that's important because other generations have had different types of experience. It could be something with property taxes or zoning or any other number of engagement related issues that they're dealing with. And so they've had more complicated, I would argue, experiences. And at the same time, they've tried to engage in the way that's comfortable for them, and not had as good of experiences as Gen Z has had up to this point. So this is one of those stats that we really want to watch over the next five years, because if Gen Z continues to stay satisfied, then they can represent that new normal, which is incredibly exciting for governments to drive that deeper engagement.

Jeff Harrell: Another interesting statistic I saw here was that 83% of Gen Z say that local government serves them well, but only 64% say that local government engages them well. So they're saying they serve them well, but they don't engage them all that well. What do you think the difference is there?

Jason Dorsey: There's a subtle difference between service and engagement and that's why our researchers wrote these questions as separate questions. So service means I've got an issue. I've got a problem. I've got a question. I'm going to reach out to you, and then you're going to help me. There's some relationship there that's going on. Engagement means staying in touch, keeping me informed whether or not I have a need at that specific time. And many in Gen Z, as we saw, they do not feel like their government is engaging them. Whether that's sharing information in a way that they can easily get, asking their opinion on ideas, trying to get them to participate, which we think is a really big deal. We certainly saw that in voting when we look at Gen Z. So in terms of serving my needs, yeah, they get done what I need. And if I have a question I can reach out to them and Gen Z would say based on their experiences, that's true. Remember, they haven't had a lot of the local government interactions that older generations have. So as a result, they don't have as many negative experiences. This number may come down over the next five to 10 years. On the flip side, that engagement number is totally one that governments can drive up just based on leveraging different technology that bitter fits how Gen Z wants to communicate and wants to engage. Because what we know from other studies we've done is engagement is really about communication. And that's what I think we're seeing reflected here.

Jeff Harrell: We did ask, how would you describe your feelings about local government and 42% of Gen Z were neutral? So there's a lot of apathy. Do you think that should be concerning to local government leaders?

Jason Dorsey: I definitely think it should be concerning because we certainly don't want this to be the high watermark, right? That would lead to lots of problems later on. So what we want government leaders to see is that Gen Z is not a lost generation. And this idea that young people, maybe just aren't interested in local government or government in general, I think that's just a false narrative. It's something that people have hated with a broad stroke for a long time. What we're seeing here is they're not feeling engaged, they're neutral about it. It's not necessarily negative. We only got 20% negative. That means that we've got 80% that are neutral or at least something positive about it. So to me, this is a huge call to action for government leaders to engage this generation right now. And the key is, to use channels. As we know that really connect with them. That's natural for them to find issues that we know are really important for them and to engage them, involve them in the solutions of that, make them feel like they're part of it. And this is not something that's just being told to them. All of which are entirely possible, all of which can be done at scale, primarily through technology is just choosing to do that. And I would argue, this has never been more important because Gen Z does represent the future and Gen Z for the first time is driving trends from the youngest to the oldest in terms of how they use phones, messaging, social media, you name it.

Jason Dorsey: So what we say to government leaders all the time is if you want to continue to be able to engage millennials, Gen X and boomers, you got to understand what Gen Z wants to do right now, because if you don't engage and adapt to Gen Z, you could end up losing the other generations too.

Jeff Harrell: The Gen Z said, "The number one barrier to engaging local government was that it feels frustrating." Is that why they're saying that?

Jason Dorsey: Absolutely. We're always trying to understand Gen Z's view of the world, how they just generally look at the world around them, how they interact with the world around them, their expectations of the world around them. And then also future looking. And when we talk with Gen Z, when we see things like frustration around engagement, for example, many times when it comes to large organizations, particularly government, Gen Z doesn't know where to start. They literally don't know where to go to even start a conversation or where to go, to start to be involved, be in the know if you will. And the challenge for a lot of them is that where they would normally go. For example, it might be social media, some of these others, government may be slow to be there or maybe hard to navigate. And then they go to a website with 712 different buttons to click on. That's also overwhelming. So I think many times Gen Z really needs a clear path of where do I go? What are my options? How simple can I make this? So I can start to drive that engagement and build that momentum and that trust. And I think that to me is the biggest barrier. It's too hard, Gen Z feels frustrated. They don't know where to go for help, and then they just don't engage.

Jeff Harrell: If you had to boil it down to one big takeaway for government leaders listening today, what would your one big takeaway be?

Jason Dorsey: The biggest takeaway I see as a generational researcher and somebody who's looked at lots and lots of data sets in this space is that Gen Z is a massive opportunity for government leaders. And it's a massive opportunity because Gen Z wants to engage. They're not necessarily negative, they're neutral at most. And in many ways they actually want to drive more of these key outcomes. Want to have better relationships, want to have more engagement with government. So I think the key though is doing what we've always done in terms of engagement and thinking it's going to work with Gen Z is not going to happen. Gen Z is not going to suddenly say, "I want to go meet in person." We saw that over and over in the data or wait in a line or have to drive somewhere. There's so many of these things that really government was just not designed to drive engagement with Gen Z. But to me, that's not a knock on government. What that really is saying, "Hey, this is a massive opportunity." And if we want to engage this generation that has energy and creativity and all these ideas and diversity and so much more that they can bring to our communities, then this is our moment to really step up and reach out to them using particularly technology, because that's what they're dependent on to drive that deeper level of engagement and create that greater sense of community. And I get incredibly excited about that.

Jeff Harrell: Well, such great insight from Jason and the research that we did together. If you want to do an even deeper dive, go back and listen to episode one of the Tyler Tech Podcast. Now let's turn our attention to Jason's generation. This is the millennials and find out more about them. What surprises did we uncover and what do you need to know to better engage this group? Well, let's find out. Let's start at the top. How do you define millennials?

Jason Dorsey: When we look at millennials, what we're trying to define a generation based on is what we call predictability by scenario. And generations in terms of the birth years, we're looking at this consistency. When do generations start being consistent and you can tell when one generation ends and another one begins. Sometimes there's a clear marker that says either you remember this, or you don't, which is the case of millennials in terms of the end of the generation. Our youngest were born about 1995 and the oldest were born somewhere around 1977, all the way up to 1980. So when we look at defining millennials, the key thing is they're born between approximately 1977 and 1995. But another way to think about them is they're people in their late twenties all the way through their thirties, and right now they're around 40, 41. They're the largest generation in the workforce, they're the fastest growing generation of consumers, and they're predominantly the trend drivers right now in most industries. So millennials, as much as they're harped on negatively on cable news and other outlets, the truth is, millennials are incredibly important to governments, to enterprises, to communities. And it's very important that we separate through this myth from truth about them.

Millennials

Jeff Harrell: Let's turn our attention to the study that we did focusing on local government. As a millennial, what do you think was the biggest surprise to you in the research that we did together?

Jason Dorsey: I think the biggest stat overall, many millennials do want to engage more with local government. I think there's this myth out there that millennials aren't interested engaging in local government, that they're tuned out and people point and blame and say, all these things about our generation. The reality is, millennials generally do want to engage more with local government and it just needs to be easier in order for them to do more of that. In fact, in many ways, they want to engage more often when it comes to other generations, engaging with local government. So I think millennials are this massive opportunity for local governments to drive much deeper engagement collaboration, I would even argue innovation. And I'd like to point out again, millennials are roughly 25 to 40, 41 ish. So this is a key constituency that if we can better engage, really does solve a lot of community problems.

Jeff Harrell: Jason, I agree with you. I feel like millennials get a bad rap. One of my kids is a millennial, hardworking kid. A lot of people say millennials don't feel positively about anything except maybe avocado toast, but it turns out about 50% of them feel positively about government. Why is that?

Jason Dorsey: There's this perception out there that millennials are very negative and don't want to engage, don't want to be productive. And I just think that's not true. And when half the millennials have a positive feeling towards government, it just shows you the potential. Many millennials have started to have positive relationships with their local government. They've had positive experiences, whether that's because they own a house now, whether that's because they're working in some other situation where they need local government assistance, like they've had some experience and oftentimes those have been positive. And so I think we got to look at this and say, there's a huge opportunity. There's 83 million millennials in the US. So half of millennials feel positive towards government. What an opportunity, not only to better engage and deeper engage at 50%, but also the other half that is not feeling positive right now. We really need to reach out to them, make it easy for them to reach out to us and drive that positivity forward. Because there's never been a time when we more need every single generation involved in local government than we do right now.

Jeff Harrell: One of the stats I thought was very interesting is 41% of millennials said they found working in local government, very appealing. That's got to be good news for local government. Ain't it?

Jason Dorsey: It is good news. I think hidden underneath that is local governments have to figure out how to recruit millennials. I see that's where things tend to fall down. I speak at lots and lots and lots of government conferences all around the world and there's this desire to work and engage in government, which we've seen repeatedly. The challenge is how local government adapts to recruit a generation that looks for a job differently. That's that leap that when we can cross that and get the message out and frankly tell the story of local government and careers and local government in a really compelling way, which I just think means a more accurate way. Then millennials get even more excited and you'll get more applicants. You can't hire people who don't apply. And the local government standpoint means how do we get more people to apply more qualified and better fit people to apply? And I think this is a massive opportunity with millennials.

Jeff Harrell: In a lot of the studies we saw millennials were very similar to Gen X here's an area where they had really aligned more with Gen Z in that 50% of them prefer to get their information from local government through social media. Is that a surprise to you?

Jason Dorsey: I don't know if it's a surprise, but it's certainly something that jumps out. And what I see here is that millennials for quick reference are roughly 25 to 40, 41 ish and Gen Z, who for the purposes of the study were roughly 18 to 24, have more similarities when it comes to where they go to get information. The reason that jumps out at us, is that these two generations have come of age with social media, Gen X and baby boomers did not. So this is the natural place where millennials and Gen Z would go for information. What I find really interesting is that they're also deeming this information to be accurate. So that means if you're a local government and you're posting updates on Twitter, then this is where they're going to get those updates. And they're assuming that those are accurate, which also creates the opportunity for other people to comment on those updates. And that's where the conversation can get really muddled. So I think the key here is that local governments need to be very thoughtful about what they put on social media and really lean on it, treats not just the very youngest, but also millennials. So if you want to reach that 18 to 40 group, which is the older members of Gen Z and millennials, you have to be using social media. That is where they're going. You can't just do a press release or a press conference or appear on the evening news. You could miss these generations entirely. You really got to use social media. And I actually think that's really empowering for local governments, because it's much easier for them to control at least what they've put out on that than when they have to go to other news sources where it could become a different type of story.

Jeff Harrell: And millennials seem to be pretty hungry for content. 14% of them said they want daily information. 36% said weekly is that because of the social media usage that they have?

Jason Dorsey: It's because of their relationship with social media. And what I mean by that is they have very, very short news cycles, right? It used to be that a news cycle was 24 hours. And even before that, it might be a week. And all of a sudden, now it's 15 minutes on Twitter. It's 30 minutes, it's an hour. So the idea that they're constantly going to be getting news updates and being able to engage with those updates, maybe even reach out and get questions answered, just shows the frequency that this generation is accustomed to. This isn't that millennials have higher expectations, which is what people often say. That's not true at all. This is all millennials have ever known. This is them just bringing what is normal to them, to an environment which happens to be engaging in local government in the same way, by the way that they're thinking about brands that they're thinking about. Employers. This to me is a really important insight because I think there's a huge opportunity for local government to better use social media, to engage generations once they recognize not only that it's important, which we've seen, but the frequency of that engagement is important.

Jeff Harrell: We know that voting has gone down with each generation. Millennials, I think less than half, say that they voted in a local election. What are some ways that local government can engage millennials better?

Jason Dorsey: We've been very surprised in our work, how little millennials know about voting and what I mean by that is, they understand how to engage on social media. They understand how to talk to their friends about a particular politician or government proposal or a piece of legislation. To some degree, they can engage about the hot topics and the people that they know. But what we find is they really don't understand or feel very confident in physically showing up to vote. And I think that's really important. There's this expectation of, "Oh, well millennials are 30 now, they should know how to vote." We are constantly shocked. I would argue just stunned by how many 30 year olds we meet who have never voted, don't know how to vote, don't know what they need in order to vote, don't know where to go to vote. And I think really making that clear and simple and I would argue highly visual videos. These long text documents, millennials don't read, millennials, take all their content in through video. So adapting how we teach people to vote, I think is really important at the same time, making it much more mobile friendly to find that location, to figure out that line, I think is important. And then letting millennials know that their vote does count because unfortunately, millennials have really been targeted in terms of misinformation that their vote doesn't count. And we have to really change that narrative. And so I think millennials are at this stage where if we engage them correctly, they will turn out to vote.

Jason Dorsey: I think social media is a really key way to do that, but I think there's just a lot of practical things that millennials don't know and understand when it comes to the process of voting. One thing that we think could be a better opportunity for many local governments is to have local community influencers talking about not just the importance of voting. Everybody says, "It's important to vote, but these are the steps involved to actually vote. And these are the type of preparations you would make in order to go there and be able to vote." I think if that happens, we will see voter turnout move up, particularly with strong local influencers.

Jeff Harrell: Well, 42% of millennials say clear, easy to use technology would make online interactions with government better. What do you think that stat means?

Jason Dorsey: I think it means that millennials are very used to engaging with enterprises, organizations and technology in a very simple way. Gen X was amazing at making things more complicated, more customized, more options. You can change everything you want. Well, now when it's got all the way down to millennials, mine's like fewest number of buttons or clicks possible. It should just happen and we need to make it easy. Otherwise it's work. And I think that's what we're seeing here. It's really a drive towards simplicity in it being able to create more of these engagements and millennials are not going to work or struggle to drive that engagement through technology because everything else in their life is so much easier and they would expect the same thing in government. So to me, I think really the strides towards simplicity and clear, easy use technology is absolutely critical for governments if they want to engage with millennials. And I would argue, with every other generation too, because every other generation now expects things to be even simpler. We're seeing that through all kinds of things from Netflix to Amazon. And that's the expectation that they're bringing in.

Jeff Harrell: We have a lot of leaders listening to this podcast. Jason, we've talked about a lot of different things. What would you say is your number one biggest takeaway for millennials?

Jason Dorsey: My biggest takeaway from the research study when it comes to millennials is that this generation really is ready to be engaged by local government. What we saw is that they have more frequency in terms of them wanting to have interactions, get updates than any other generation. They're generally positive towards government, which I think is a surprise to a lot of people and that they see technology as the way to drive that deeper engagement. So to me, this really is a rally cry to local government to say, "Hey, millennials are here. They're at the right age, the life stage. They bring exactly the energy we need. It's up to us to adapt to them. And when we do so we can really unlock their potential, which I think is incredibly exciting." And I am a millennial, so I want that to happen too.

Gen X

Jeff Harrell: Well. Jason's passion for this topic is so infectious. I learned a lot about millennials. If you want to do an even deeper dive, go back and listen to episode two of the Tyler Tech Podcast. Now let's turn our attention to the greatest generation. Of course that's Gen X and that's just my opinion, but let's find out if Jason agrees. Here's our conversation on the research we did on Generation X.

Jason Dorsey: When we look at Gen X, born roughly 1965 to 1976 ish. And if you missed out on our other podcast, go back and listen to how we talk about generations. Because we view them at our research center here, Center for Generational Kinetics as clues and not a box. So when you hear birth years, what you need to know is we're not putting people in boxes based on the exact day you were born, but these are clues to better understand and faster connect with people. And you can be born on the edges of those generations, which happens a lot with Gen X. And you're what we call a cusper and that's somebody who has characteristics of the generation before and after. So you could be a mix of say baby boomers and Gen X or Gen X and millennials. The key thing to know is right now, Gen X is at a really career defining moment.

Jason Dorsey: And this is so important for people who want to engage them. Gen X is at this stage where, when we talk to them, we do so much research with them where they think they have one, two, maybe three career promotions left, they're deciding whether or not they want to stay with their current company and finish their career or go somewhere else. Many of them often have kids. Those kids are increasingly older. So they're dealing with that and what's not talked about enough. And this is so important when we think about local government engagement, Gen X is also taking care of their parents for the first time. So they're really being pulled in both directions. And I think that's so important, important life stage for Gen X important career moment for Gen X and their generation that we should be talking about enough.

Jeff Harrell: Let's turn our attention to the research that we did together. You've done a lot of research into the generations. I think this is the one of the first you've done around government. What was the biggest surprise that you've uncovered with this research around Gen X?

Jason Dorsey: I think what jumped out to me was that there were lots of points in the research where through our analysis, we see that Gen X were similar to baby boomers and there's been this narrative for a long time that Gen X and boomers are very different from each other. But the reality is, as Gen X continues to get older, we're increasingly finding similarities and that's where we see life stage and generations collide. So I think the fact that we're now seeing Gen Xers sound more like boomers in some way is pretty shocking for a lot of people. And also in our work being data driven, very exciting.

Jeff Harrell: Gen X were very similar to boomers in that 59% of them said they prefer local government information from a website and not from social media, is that because social media was not a part of their lives for so long. What's the why behind that?

Jason Dorsey: One is that neither generation grew up with social media. So it's not their default place to go for information in the way that it certainly is for millennials and Gen Z. The other side is Gen X is skeptical. So for them, social media is not something they necessarily trust. And we've seen this in lots and lots and lots of studies that we've done. So it would make sense for Gen X to say, "Hey, I want to go to the website that's actually controlled by the local government to get that piece of information." And at the same point, baby boomers are likely to do the same thing because that's, what's comfortable and normal for them. So I think what you're seeing here is both generational and learned behaviors coming together. And that's why you're seeing those similarities.

Jeff Harrell: And that information that they're getting from government actually 59% of them said that they're actually satisfied with the information they're getting from local government. That was the highest I think of any group that we looked at. Why do you think that is?

Jason Dorsey: Because Gen X wants to go to the source, they are skeptical. They want to know where you get your information from and what better place than directly from the local government itself on a website that's controlled by the local government where they can provide direct access and other links to additional information. So for Gen X, that is a great way for them to go right to the source, get access to that information and then see other related information all in one. And so for Gen X, it works really well versus say, millennials who want to go check it on social media, see what other influencers wrote. Everything else that goes on. This is a very satisfying experience for Gen X to go to a website.

Jeff Harrell: And we asked the different generations what are the services that you want to use more often and this is the highest of any group, more than half of Gen X, want to use parks and rec more often, is that because they have older kids and grandkids, what do you think the why behind that is?

Jason Dorsey: Definitely children, grandchildren are contributing factors. We also see candidly Gen X getting older and feeling like quality of life is now very important. So that's going out, being outdoors, doing something a little bit athletic, whether that's physical activity and actually exercising or just going for a long walk. So they're getting to that life stage where it's important for them to go and think about their health. So we're seeing more of that along with making memories rather than material things, being a focus. So all of that goes together to say that Gen X is a group that really is engaging in parks and rec more. We think that will continue by the way.

Jeff Harrell: So even though we're skeptical, we rate government high across the board. 84% say government serves them well and 73% say government engages them well. Why do you think Gen X rates government so high?

Jason Dorsey: Well, that one was definitely a big surprise for our research team. Normally, Gen X doesn't rate anything high. So for them to say generally across the board that they rate it very high, that was something unexpected and a surprise for us. My belief on that, and I talk to our researchers about it, is again, it's comfortable for them to engage with government in the way that government has been engaging with them through technology, particularly via websites and Gen X also remembers how painful it was before technology, right?

Jason Dorsey: So for them, rather than having all these coming of age experiences where you had to go meet in person and do that type of thing, Gen X was there, remember at the rise of the PC and all this. So they were there at the moment when they remember how hard it was to engage with government before technology and how great it is compared to that versus millennials and Gen Z who don't have any recollection of that, all they go is, "Why is this not faster, easier, simpler?" And Gen X is going, "Oh, you should have seen it before." So I do think there's higher satisfaction tied to that.

Jeff Harrell: One of the stats I thought was very interesting is that Gen X rated economic and community development way higher in importance than any other group did, is that because you think they're starting to see retirement on the horizon and want to maximize the remaining years they have to work?

Jason Dorsey: There's definitely a recognition that their timeline to continue working is finite. I think part of that's being driven by their parents actually struggling financially. As they look ahead, they're now having to support their parents in ways that many of them did not think they would, and their parents oftentimes have outlived, unfortunately, their savings or different backstops. So that's happening. And what we're saying is that they really think Gen X thinks economic development is very important and they think it will continue to be important. And so I think that this is really representative of their life stage, what they've been through and remember these recessions and recoveries that they've been through.

Jason Dorsey: But unlike baby boomers, Gen X still thinks they have time to work. So they're really focused on engaging these economic development pieces. And the idea that these economic development pieces can actually drive gains. I mean, Gen X has actually seen that, they've seen economic development, bring employers, they've seen them bring stimulus, they've seen them create and drive these changes and they recognize that's really important. So again, I think that's both generation life stage, but also just the time when Gen X has come of age, particularly around local government.

Jeff Harrell: This was a stat that I thought was very interesting. 81% of Gen X said better technology would go a long way towards helping local government better technology. Is that interesting to you like it was to me, Jason?

Jason Dorsey: It is interesting. At the end of the day, technology is our really key focus as it intersects with different generations. And the fact that Gen X place is such a high weight or high value on the idea that better technology would go a long way to helping local government, I think is a very clear signal that local government should pay attention to this. And this is a huge opportunity. So this isn't just about engaging millennials or Gen Z and younger citizens, but Gen X thinks this is really important too. And to me, that is a huge takeaway.

Jeff Harrell: Looking at all the research that we did, looking at Gen X, what do you think was the biggest takeaway for you?

Jason Dorsey: The biggest takeaway I would say was probably the idea that they prefer local government information from a website and not social media. We've seen some shift with Gen X where they're starting to look towards social media increasingly. We're not sure if that's because they're using it more, they're more comfortable with it. They feel like they can better filter out fake versus good information, but I would've expected to still see a little bit more on the social media side. So the fact that websites continue to be so incredibly important. That to me, is something that says, "Hey, we need to not just focus on social media, but particularly with Gen X, we need to make sure that our websites are really good on mobile, easy to navigate, get people the information they want and allow for the interactions that they want."

Baby Boomers

Jeff Harrell: Well, great information from Jason in a bit of a surprise on the importance of websites with Gen X. If you want to get a little bit more insight, go back and listen to episode three of the Tyler Tech Podcast. Now last, but definitely not least let's turn to baby boomers. What surprises did we uncover about this very influential generation? Well, let's find out with Jason Dorsey. I feel like boomers in a lot of ways, get some bad rap. You hear the okay boomer and the get off my yard kind of stuff. Maybe first define what we mean by baby boomer.

Jason Dorsey: The first thing we look at are birth years. And if you missed out on some of the earlier podcasts, we've done definitely go back and check them out because we talk more about generations and how they're clues and not a box and how they're predictable. And they help us to drive more trust and influence. When we look at baby boomers, they were born roughly 1946 to 1964. And what a lot of times younger generations don't know is, baby boomers got their name because they literally were born during a baby boom, following World War II. So birth rates skyrocketed and created this huge generation of 80 million plus people. And this generation, as you can imagine, had very formative events coming up through the fifties and sixties and early seventies. And this generation right now is actually the most influential generation in the workforce and also in communities.

Jason Dorsey: And people don't realize that, but it's not just because baby boomers are the ones who tend to vote more than anyone else, but it's also because they tend to control the wealth in most of the country and most of the world, they also tend to have the longest relationships across generations, they tend to be in senior leadership roles, serve on boards, control access to capital, you name it. So baby boomers really are an incredibly important generation, which is why I get offended when people are like, "Okay, boomer. I think it's time to give boomers a lot more respect than they're getting."

Jeff Harrell: I know you guys have done a lot of research. This is one of the first though that you've done really specifically looking at government. What was one of the biggest surprises that you saw through the research relative to baby boomers?

Jason Dorsey: The biggest one that jumped out at me is that baby boomers said the number one way that they wanted to engage with government was not email or website, but in person or on the phone, I thought we would see some shifting at this point where they might say they wanted to go through a website or use some other technology, but they very strongly said that they still wanted to sit across from somebody or see somebody face to face or talk on the phone. And that was a surprise to me. I really thought at this point we might see some more movement around that, but it's not there yet, but it's definitely something that governments have to recognize.

Jason Dorsey: And my read on that, Jeff is that governments have to really be flexible and accommodating to every generation. You're going to have some groups that still want to communicate in person or by phone. And then as we saw so strongly and talked about on the other podcast, you have all these other groups that want to use websites, that want to use email, that want to use chat, that want to use social media and governments have to be able to address all of those stakeholders in their community.

Jeff Harrell: And like you said, I think boomers are, they most likely to engage with local government, but the way they define engagement is actually different than the other generations. Isn't it's basically voting and paying taxes.

Jason Dorsey: Right. You can see what their priorities are. And voting, I think, was particularly strong given how much they clearly like to vote, feel if that's active participation and supporting to them on the paying taxes side that has to do, I would argue as much with life stage as it does with generations. Boomers have owned houses. They came of age at a time when you created wealth by owning a home that was your forced savings plan. And so for many of them, that was what they did.

Jason Dorsey: So they've been paying property taxes in particular for a long time. So this is something where they've just engaged with that, they're accustomed to it, they're used to it. I would argue, many of them plan their calendars around it. And so you could see why that to them is that level of engagement. Because when they think of government, they think of taxes and the fact that their taxes keep increasing. And for many of them they're trying to do things like homestead and other things to get their taxes to cap out. So that's certainly something that we're seeing, but that's, I think representative of life stage as well as generation.

Jeff Harrell: Boomers and Gen X were similar in how they wanted to find or receive information from local government, some generations they wanted social media, but 56% of boomers said they prefer information via the web. Is that a surprise to you?

Jason Dorsey: It is. And I think there's a subtle differentiation because what I want to point out here is the question we talked about a moment ago was about how they're most likely to engage with government and also that they want to engage in person or by phone is that's the way they would want to interact yet, when we actually look at what they're doing, it is a little bit different. And I think this is where we get into these really nuanced and important attitudes versus what have you historically done? What would you love to do, but what have you actually doing? And we start to see differences. And so when you see boomers in Gen X being similar, I think again, this is because of where they came of age. And so rather than social media, which they don't really trust. In fact, many baby boomers in our research tell us they specifically distrust social media. The fact that they would prefer the web to that makes a ton of sense because at least they feel like they can trust the source. They can see what the source is. They can source other reference, other information if they want to. And again, many of them are now using the web for example, to pay bills and so forth. So it's a natural place for them to go. Social media, we interview so many boomers on this. Boomers just really think it's the wild west and they can't tell easily who to trust or who not do so it would be expected that they would carry that over in terms of how they want to interact with government.

Jeff Harrell: Jason, this next stat absolutely blew my mind. 24% of boomers say they have never had a positive experience with local government. How is that actually possible?

Jason Dorsey: That was my favorite stat out of the entire study. You've got a generation that has interacted with local government more than any other generation in the study. And remember we study Gen Z, millennials, Gen X and boomers, and yet almost a quarter of all boomers said, they've never had a positive experience of any kind with their local government. I don't know if that means that they're truly dissatisfied or if they've never been wowed by that experience or frankly, I would argue how they choose to engage with that local government may limit the range of positive experiences they have. But at the end of the day, when you can get to just translate these in the real numbers, 20 million boomers who are saying they've never had a positive experience that leaves a lot of opportunity there.

Jeff Harrell: So Jason, do you think that means local government should just stop trying?

Jason Dorsey: I take it on as the opposite, right? I think you and I both agree that this is a really pivotal moment for local governments to adapt, to reach every generation. And I don't count baby boomers as a lost generation in this course. I think this raises the bar and says, "What we've done in the past isn't working with boomers." And I'd argue, we probably haven't given them enough incentive or motivation to get them to try something new. And now's really a great opportunity to use that innovation, to make it so much easier for boomers to engage with local government. And that gets me fired up. I love opportunities like that.

Jeff Harrell: When we asked, what are the most important services local government provides? 56% of boomers said law enforcement, public safety and fire. That was 20 points higher than any other group. What do you think that means?

Jason Dorsey: I think that one speaks to both what boomers experienced growing up, many of them in the 60s and 70s, but also I think it speaks to their life stage. And what we find there is this desire for safety and security. There's also a desire for rules and order. Boomers very much came of age in times of policies, procedures, rules, and so forth. So all of that makes sense. And I would argue that many boomers look at that and they also think of their families, family members and communities, and that's where safety and other things come about. So to me to see that big divide really is telling of the generation how they look across all the services provided by local government. I love that stat because again, it just shows you what is so important and the services that really speak to them and where they are.

Jeff Harrell: We talked about voting earlier and we know that boomers are almost twice as likely to vote in local elections than let's say Gen Z. And we know there's no big surprise there, but they're the least likely to engage with local government in any other way. What would you say to local governments to maybe engage boomers a little bit better?

Jason Dorsey: Boomers define engagement by voting. To them that is what you do. It's an honor, it's a right. It's a privilege and they really take it seriously. Particularly as you start to look at things like social security and other things that tend to come through the government. We see them being very active, very involved in anything that's going to directly impact them. And for many of them, this is really key. So there's lots and lots tied to voting in general that fits where baby boomers are. On the flip side, what we see is, engagement with local government shouldn't be just voting. It shouldn't be, I just showed up and voted and therefore I'm engaged. Being a part of the conversation, communicating, collaborating, working on new ideas, all of these things are a huge opportunity for governments, local governments in particular to better engage baby boomers. And I think that's really important.

Jason Dorsey: I also think, if you flip this around and look at the other generations we study, there's an opportunity to get other generations to vote more and also model that behavior. So what strikes me in all the research we did together, there's a national study, a very low margin of error weighted through the US census for age, gender, geography, ethnicity, you name it, is that there's an opportunity with every single generation for local government to better engage them, to better gauge them on their terms and to drive more of these key actions that we all know we need and want.

Jason Dorsey: And so that gets me very fired up, but it is different by generation. And I think that's why for those of you that didn't listen to the other podcasts, definitely go back and listen to them because the insights are so different by generation. And that's what gets me fired up about this work. We're always discovering something new.

Jeff Harrell: So let's wrap this up, Jason. Well, there's a lot of community leaders, a lot of government leaders listening to this and thinking through boomers, all the research that we did together, what was your biggest takeaway?

Jason Dorsey: My biggest takeaway, particularly since this is the last of the generational podcast here is that every generation is different. There are some clear similarities, but every single generation has differences and leaders should see and recognize these differences. Now what's important is you don't have to agree with those differences, but if you want to effectively engage each generation, you do have to recognize them and choose to adapt from my view as a researcher, technology seems to be that through line of what they all want to drive more engagement and they want to be able to do it on a way that's comfortable, easy and effective for them on their own terms.

 

Jason Dorsey: And I think boomers, as we saw here now have more in common sometimes with Gen X, which is really fascinating. And then at the same time, they look at engagement differently and we need every single generation to be engaged. So my biggest takeaway overall even is that there's a massive opportunity for local and for government leaders to better connect with and drive these conversations with each generation, which frankly, our world needs. And that gets me so excited to be a part of that solution.

Jeff Harrell: Well, I love how Jason pointed out that there are differences in each generation, but technology is a through line that connects them all. If you want a little bit more insight into baby boomers, go back and listen to episode four of the Tyler Tech podcast. Well, I hope you've enjoyed this compilation and it has armed you with some great information as we launch into this new year. We've got a lot of great episodes planned for 2021. So please remember to subscribe. We drop a new episode every other Monday. And with that I'm Jeff Harrell director of content marketing for Tyler Technologies. Thanks again for joining me. We'll talk to you soon.